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out of everybody in the entire world you and your partner have one the one thing in common that you have with that person that you don’t have with anybody else is that you two share the same bed if I don’t have some level of freedom to like enjoy you and you and join me where it’s always this like clinical sign this consent form before I can like kiss my wife it’s gonna feel like I’m almost like a robotic relationship too so we judge everybody else by their behaviors and we judge ourselves by our intentions we always no matter what whether we’re judging you or me judging me we have to apply both we have to look at behaviors and intentions [Music] what’s up coronation welcome to another episode of coin for thought today on this episode we have Jacqueline Lebeau Jackie is the founder of evolve counseling she’s a registered psychotherapist and a clinical trauma specialist that’s a mouthful but she’s on this episode here today to talk about sexual abuse in a relationship thanks for having me yeah thanks for coming on the podcast again I love having you on the show because I think you’re so incredibly insightful and I think that a lot of what you do really stands out from the way that the industry runs psychotherapy or psychology traditionally yeah and which is like a lot of really talk therapy so a lot of times I feel like clients or patients like their patients for you patients are technically going to see therapists when they could just be seeing a best friend because they spent the whole hour just talking and their therapist was like okay and maybe reassuring feelings are being kind of a sounding board to their feelings uh while not really giving practical to tools or advice so I I have a lot of admiration for what you do because you give clients the tools for success you send them off on their way and they’re able to now know and understand these tools and apply them and come to you for like maybe a session here and there for maintenance if they need it if they come into a challenge where they don’t really understand how to apply the tools that now they understand yeah right I always say to them you have a best friend you don’t need to pay me the money to vent at me right so I’m trying to know how to solve all these problems right so I’m going to teach you what I know so when you’re in your day-to-day stuff you now know how to resolve it right you can’t always just get a hold of me in the moment that the issue is so instead of having to wait three or four more days for your session I’d rather see my client be able to handle their own situation in the moment so right instead of just talk therapy I do a lot of thought restructuring I use my whiteboard to teach them actual formulas actual skills yeah that they can change the way they’re perceiving things yeah no that’s so right I I want to jump into it because I think that this is a really hot topic um sexual abuse is a very now we’ve we’re redefining sexual abuse in different ways like with groping and this and that and and maybe not even contact right sometimes um someone can sexually advancing towards you and that can be termed as sexual abuse and I think that people are a lot more receptive to the victim and how they feel and how now people should be respecting each other from a sexual point of view but I think that oftentimes in relationships all those rules get lost a lot of that goes out the window and I feel like a lot of my clients are always in situ not always but I hear this a lot where they come to me and they say I’m having issues with my husband I think I’m I’m looking to get a divorce why why are you looking to leave this person they seem so nice they seem to do it no it’s just and it’s because of that sexual issue where it’s like he forces me to have sex with him when I don’t want to I feel uncomfortable in this relationship even though everything is okay he’s my provider he helps around the house he does all these things for me but our bedroom matters are now spilling outside of the bedroom and making me feel a certain way where I don’t feel safe yeah and the other side of that is for him my wife doesn’t ever want to have sex with me so while she’s feeling like he always wants to have sex with me as a female he’s like but she never wants to have sex with me so I have a lot of male clients who come and they’re like how do I get my wife to have sex with me more mm-hmm right and you know then I have to pull the wife and see what’s going on as the underlying issue obviously if there’s anything medical or like anything physical especially after you know females bodies go through a lot after having kids so and looking at under any underlying other mental health issues like depression is going to lower any kind of sex drive if you’re on medication that’s going to lower your sex drive so really in those cases I really have to pull from their circle of care team from all their medical professionals what does the big picture look like for this client so that I can target in on why does this person not have a sex drive or why are they not really interested in having sex let’s go back to basics and really define what a positive sexual interaction or transaction looks like well I always say it starts outside of the bedroom you need to first have that respect one-on-one in the marriage or the relationship with your partner I have to emotionally respect you otherwise you’re not going to want to have sex with me because you don’t feel safe with me outside of the bedroom so if there’s any kind of emotional abuse emotional neglect in the relationship or you’re not feeling safe with your partner outside of that of the bedroom it’s going to be really difficult to have a safe connection where you need to be more vulnerable with each other in the bedroom right so I always look at what’s happening in the home outside the bedroom first that has to be a safe space for people to want to come in to have a healthy connection in the bedroom any kind of consent has to be there 100 of the time right otherwise the other person is gonna feel like I just feel validated even if the person who wanted to have sex isn’t like forceful or isn’t like you know it sounds like but now you’re making me feel like I rape my wife right but that’s not what we’re talking we’re talking about she’s still gonna feel like I’m I’m um violated in some way right because I was forced to do something that I didn’t necessarily want to or feel like I was in the mood for so you want to make sure you’re reading the room that this person is into doing this with me right there’s two of you in that connection it’s two of our bodies that are coming together as one so we both really need to be fully into what we’re doing in this moment for it to be healthy in the bedroom okay there’s a lot of women as you know as we get older there’s a lot of women that like amp up their sex drive right and then there’s a lot of women that have now zero interest in having sex and having that connection but they are fulfilled by other connections other ways to connect with their spouse but this is the one thing that’s lacking right what is that what does that look like for a partner so which partner are you talking to the person about the person who isn’t I’m not having sex because they don’t want to say if you lose your sex drive you don’t want to have sex anymore you’re in a relationship with somebody and now they went from their their wife girlfriend who loved having sex with them now all of a sudden they’re not getting that that connection the the dynamic of that relationship has changed because now the people have changed or one person has changed what do you do in a situation I know you were talking about with women it’s important to be able to keep practicing sexual activity so I find that with women’s sex drive the more you have sex the more that your body will want to have sex this almost comes back to conditioning right women’s like we all always go back to like our basic instincts when we’re in the bedroom like so for women like most women don’t like the way we look naked right so for us to be able to go into a bedroom with a man we have to really be in a more vulnerable place to be naked right men don’t have that same connection to their bodies of like I don’t like how I look right women are harder on their bodies but we project onto men that they think about our bodies the way we do and that’s not true men typically don’t have the same issues about a female body they see a female who’s naked that guy’s gonna love that body right but I think when it comes to the basic needs of women a lot of females are like I want to have sex to have babies as soon as the baby you’re done having babies and you’ve had a couple kids and you’ve made the decision with your partner we’re no longer having kids that’s where I find women’s sex drive almost shuts off and I’m not talking about postpartum issues with depression over you take that outside of it and you just look at most marriages the females like I’m done having kids so like like they stop wanting to have that sex and they don’t see it as the connection with the husband you’re also tired women are working full-time raising kids with their partners taking care of a home so everybody’s kind of tired right but I think what you need to do is always going back to remembering your love languages within the relationship for 90 of men’s love language is physical so if you remove the physical from the relationship he’s going to start to feel like I’m not wanted I’m not desired and that boils down to what most men want is I want my wife to really love me and desire me and want to be with me physically right so for women when the sex drive disappears how do you keep this moving forward I have to connect them emotionally because for women there’s an emotional attachment first that comes into play and often that emotional connection becomes disconnected because of the kids because of jobs because of like all these other things happening in life once the emotional disconnect happens typically the female loses the physical right men can still want to have sex and all men do want to have sex still even if there’s no emotional connection between them during the daytime right so if I work on the emotional connection then typically the female is willing and more open to wanting to increase the sexual because her sex drive is now going up when she feels love and I feel sexy and I feel attractive right but I also work from the male and the male’s angle at um how do I make her feel like really sexy and like I’m desiring her which will turn her on more as well I kind of disagree with you on the attraction side where you’re like guys will just kind of screw anything or whatever you’re like you know if there’s a naked girl or there’s a naked woman yeah you know it’s easier for a man to be able to wanna whatever but but men are men come from a physical mind yes women come from an emotional moment but I find that like a lot of men are so particular like there’s there’s types I like blondes I like brunettes I’m a bum guy I’m a boob guy right you know like even if you look at how women have evolved right over time like before like Marilyn Monroe time yeah like the heavier stat woman was considered a lot more attractive at that time if you were skinny it meant like you’re poor you didn’t eat yeah right and the larger you were the wealthier you were the more attractive you were right um things have kind of changed over time and then like when I was growing up it was all about like stick skinny model like you know that that appearance right now it’s all about this tiny little waist like extremely large brass extremely large bombs very Kardashian-esque sort of vibe and like the big lips the the porn star vibe and I think that like what it’s hard for a woman to really understand what a man is really attracted to and where on the spectrum do you fall under especially when a lot of these qualities that men vocally ask for are based off of plastic surgery but you have to go back to the root of what’s driving all these changes because the male body is never highlighted to where do you see in any kind of media the man’s body ever changing to be all these it’s not that’s driven by female to female target audience so the person or the group the population that’s driving the female body changes isn’t men it’s women because we saw you have bigger lips than me so I’m gonna go get lip fillers I’m not talking to men about like oh my god my eyebrows aren’t are not like symmetrical right I’m talking to women right so we compare ourselves to women we’re not comparing our bodies to men men are kind of on the sidelines being like I think you overall I’ve never had a husband come in and he wasn’t like I love her body no matter what and I’ve seen I’ve seen wives who are super skinny who are athletic who are heavy who are really heavy and across the board their husband is still like I want to have sex with my wife it’s not I don’t have sex with her because she’s gained 20 pounds that goes to like a different attraction maybe that yeah I’d like a hot skinny wife but at the root of it men still want to have sex with their wife no matter what size they are so the driving force between behind why women’s bodies are changing so much to like now we’re into that Kardashian look is women is it okay to be able to tell your husband that you don’t want to have sex with him and say no and have him respect that without feeling a sense of guilt or obligation yes it’s okay but it’s really hard to do that I think that in relationships when you say no to somebody you’re in an automatic I’m rejecting you moment when you’re at your most vulnerable asking for something right so when I say no to you in this moment of like I want to be close to you and you’re rejecting me and then you add in any past traumas for him he’s going to take that rejection to a different level and she’s going to be feel bad that I’ve made you feel rejected so is it okay yes but the natural feelings that come are rejection and guilt so that’s that’s where you have to learn how to say no in a healthy way so that he feels love still and she can walk away not feeling guilty because I I’m like no I’m too tired and dismissive right versus like hey I really love you I love your body I do want to feel close with you let’s set up a date night tomorrow where we can like explore each other’s bodies and like have fun with us versus tonight where we’ve both been running around all day but where you know you’re able to talk to him in a way where he still feels like she still wants and desires me is it good to be able to make appointments with your partner for sex I often it depends on the relationship but when I work with couples where there’s absolutely no sex now we’re talking and there hasn’t been sex for a long time we’re talking about mind conditioning the only way for me to get a cup like a one of my couples back into that sex drive is to get them to have sex more but if one person or they’re not having sex and they’ve been so used to not having sex for a year I get them to schedule sex and it’s not about scheduling sex it’s a and I know that sounds awful to say let’s schedule this in but what it does is it allows the starting process of the mind conditioning that after a month of it’ll probably be faster than a month but after a few weeks of it being scheduled you’ll stop for you’ll stop remembering to schedule it and it will turn into something natural now so that’s the it’s the end goal of scheduling sex that I want to see that it becomes something natural now in the relationship how many times do you find that women are women turn to sexual rejection when it comes to their personal relationships because of a past trauma like they’ve been sexually abused as a child or they’ve been sexually abused in a past relationship or you know this even though their partner is safe they are sext or the in that sort of transaction way of loving each other is bringing up trauma from their past I would say every single female client of mine has at some point been cheated on by a past partner which is still in that realm of like I don’t feel safe now with sex because you’ve hurt me with sex right you’ve had sex with somebody else which is a rejection of me so I’m going to carry that into my new relationship and worry that he’s going to cheat on me right even if we’re in a healthy relationship at one point that female has felt like violated in some way that he put his hands on me when I did when I wasn’t like expecting or didn’t necessarily want it or there was that obligation of I have to have sex with my husband tonight because he’s put the pressure on all day long or made underhanded comments that like oh you never want to with me or you never do this and then it’s that manipulation that happens right and or there was a more extreme sexual assault where yes now we’re doing more intensive therapy to work through that healing because it wasn’t just I’m violated in like a mild way it’s I’m violated in a traumatic physical way so now I don’t feel safe with anybody in that space so I would say most women at some point in their life have had a negative experience with like that physical response from a partner even if it’s mild how should men approach because I feel like it’s tricky for men to be able to approach a sexual relationship with a woman now because especially in this world where there’s a lot of women calling out on sexual assault there’s the metoo movement there’s there’s a lot happening and I even when I speak to men that I know about this they’re like oh my gosh is it even worth like going out with a girl like falling for her having that sexual interaction without getting a paper signed almost to say that this is consensual um is that what do you think about that about how men are to approach it what really is that protocol I honestly I feel for men right now I like it is it great that women are taking a stand and really defending themselves and being more grounded in like no this is my body my rights right but at the same time there was that swing that happened where now men are like well wait a second you know if if I’m seeing in the news that like oh I put my hand on a female’s back to guide her through the doorway and she’s now saying that person sexually assaulted her how do I even like approach dating especially as like a guy in this world in the day I hear a lot of my single men they’re like right how am I supposed to date now right I think you have to be take a position of really reflecting and reading her body language in the moments where we’re coming together physically so like at the end of a first date you know is she leaning in towards you or she trying to escape the vehicle fast you’re probably not going to ask for a kiss if she’s trying to like run away from the scene right so I think it’s really about going to like observation versus action which you and I talk about all the time learning to go into situations and observing them more right so right I think you have to men need to almost let the female lead in that department initially so that you can get a read on what does she want up front versus now we’re in the relationship a bit we can be more talkative and vocal about what are the expectations of this but I even talked to my male clients about at the beginning of your date with this person be transparent with your communication about what’s what is it that you need or expect from this date tonight when it comes to the physical especially if she’s talked about any past traumas or you know he cheated on me and I felt hurt or my dad you know wasn’t necessarily a great father figure to me to show me what healthy connections with men are or there was any sexual trauma in the past you want to really have open communication with her I feel like also women need to be more upfront about that too yeah because I I find that sometimes you know say in the past my girlfriends would be like oh he didn’t kiss me at the end of the night and I’m upset or you know women are now and we’ve come such a long way I feel like we are in a position now to really take the lead and there’s well and not be like you know every man but a lot of men are listening and they’re allowing for women to really take the lead and be able to say yeah you can totally kiss me I don’t have to kiss you first yeah right uh you can totally initiate sex with me you are able to say no and there’s so many respectful men out there but no one teaches men how to be respectful in this realm it’s kind of a trial and error thing yeah but it always goes we’ve been conditioned a bit too with like disney movies right it’s always like the female and like the man comes in and like saves us right and it’s always the man taking the lead but you I always try to go back to understanding like the basic instincts of both genders so for men they go back to more of that animal instinct in the bedroom of I want to dominate her I want to take the lead they want to feel like some area in their life I have a little bit more control or power in this moment right do men like having a female who can be more forward and take the lead and just like go up and do whatever 100 percent yes so women do need to come out of that but you’re my night and shiny number you need to come and rescue me all the time no we need to accept that women need to come forward in that area as well to say like let’s go I want you tonight right versus like him always taking the lead but I think it’s a vulnerable space for women to be in at the same time so when we’re like I said before when we’re in that space of I have to be naked and I hate my body and he’s going to be seeing me it’s really hard to think about putting the moves on a guy when you’re in the headspace of I don’t even like myself right now in this moment so that’s where it always comes back to really reading the person’s body language in the moment and really communicating what do you like what you don’t like communicating who should lead who shouldn’t lead how do you get over not liking yourself physically being ashamed of certain parts of you especially you know after after kids your body as a woman changes I remember looking in the mirror one day and it was like before my shower and I was so exhausted from having the twins and managing them all day and I hadn’t showered in like three days you know this was like right after I had them in the first few months and you know I remember turning to the mirror and looking at myself in the mirror going what is that like not even who is that but what is that I didn’t recognize I knew I was looking at myself but I didn’t recognize the person that was staring back at me it almost seemed like a figure but that wasn’t that wasn’t me and now taking that to the bedroom you know women feel that way that’s really hard and like for me I’ve had a tummy tuck because my my stomach was a sack so I’m very like if something is wrong with your body go ahead obviously don’t overdo it but go fix that and I’m a really big promoter of that but there’s lots of women that maybe don’t have that access to just fixing it because it is expensive you know so like it’s a 20 000 tummy tuck like not everybody can afford that so I think that you know what do you do in that situation where you now have this new body that you have to deal with you are rejecting your partner that loves you they are pushing for this intimate connection because that’s how that’s their love language and we’ll talk a little bit more about defining love languages and you just don’t want to and then you feel forced to and then there’s commentary and I hear this all the time sometimes men will make jokes that end up being more harming than yeah helpful all the time like they’ll be like oh my gosh she’s such a dead fish yeah or stuff like that and it’s that it’s those little things that that run really deep it’s those comments that you just really remember he may say you’re beautiful you’re beautiful you’re beautiful but then he says one thing like you’re a dead fish or makes a comment about your arms or your legs or your stomach or whatever the case is it’s those little things that then you’ll remember and you’ll be like whoa all of a sudden there’s a barrier there’s a wall between you and yeah yes that’s what I was talking about earlier where the space in the home the emotional connection has to be safe first so if he’s attacking your body making fun of any of your body parts all ready for female without any past traumas or any rejection or anything negative just being naked is vulnerable for women right so now if you’re in your home and you have a male who’s making fun of your body or like making fun of you in a sexual experience that’s also being stored as trauma so it’s not as likely for me to want to be like let’s go have sex right now if you’ve just made fun of me right so then we have to in therapy work on building confidence and self-esteem and really analyzing both sides like working with him on how to undo and correct some of the things he said to make her feel beautiful but it takes a thousand attaboys to undo one moment of harsh criticism so in order to undo that one negative comment he has like months of work to really repair the damage that he’s caused and I also have months of work to help him repair it with her so um I think going back to your question of like how does how does this person you know feel like I want to be in this after I’ve just had kids and I don’t like the way my body looks I never look at the first few months after somebody has a baby right that’s not really a fair space for a female to be in to put any pressure or force her to have any obligation to be physical right there’s been like physical things that have happened that might be causing her pain there’s emotional things that have that are changing with hormones that might be impacting her mental health right so I try to ask for like a six month window with the couple to say no expectations in this time frame right outside of that six months though and in within that six month we’re gonna work on you know I asked the question do you like the body that you are in right now if the answer to that is yes we’re not touching anything then I don’t care what size you are I don’t care what shape I don’t care what the scale says as long as you’re healthy I if the answer to that is no I’m not happiness then we start to set goals in therapy and put dates attached those goals so and I’ll pull in my other like resources of nutritionists and personal trainers and I get their gp involved to like assess health and like like blood pressure and all that to make sure they’re on track to meet those goals and then we start chipping away at the goals and getting them to a body that they love but a lot of this takes months and it’s going to take time so I have to work with a couple on understanding compassion and patience it’s hard to if you’ve gained a lot of weight really fast right you’re in a new body you might not know how to look at it you may not know how to dress it right uh you haven’t had that body for a very long time you may have been a size zero now you’re a size 10. that’s a very different space to be in and your partner might be used to you being smaller and now all of a sudden you’re bigger and you know I I think that you know it’s very easy for me say to turn around and tell my husband oh my gosh you need to stop eating that your belly’s getting really big um but say for example it’s not as socially acceptable for husbands or boyfriends to turn around and tell their wives or girlfriends or fiances hey you’re getting really thought yeah right I always tell them to bring it to me if I’m working with a couple I am the one who realized that information because I know how to do it in a way that she’s not going to feel insulted right and coming from me it’s not she doesn’t need me to be attracted to her right right for advice so for men who are not working with a therapist it’s I would do it through experience and power of example versus conversation verbally I would start to exercise more and I would start to eat better and bring my wife in that way versus having a verbal a verbal conversation that might leave her feeling insulted right so hey babe what about tonight we have like healthy options for tacos and even like gradually increase healthy eating or let’s start going for walks in it they really want to connect with you and get out of the house and get into nature and it’s not even coming from a point of view of let’s do this to lose weight let’s let’s motivate ourselves by connect I want to do this to connect with you more she’s more likely to want to do that then I need to walk with you so that we can both lose weight it’s all in the approach how long do you think it takes when you’re working with couples for them to get to a healthy sexual space from being in a very unhealthy one you’re going from zero to ten what kind of time frame is is does that really look like it depends on I have to assess what’s happened before to both of them what’s going on now and is there like a disconnect in the emotional part that I have to fix first right if they’re in a toxic marriage that’s highly abusive and yelling and screaming and physical abuse and like you know it’s really toxic I’m not really focused on the sex part I’m more focused on why are you staying in this relationship but if we’re looking at a healthy couple who’s just like lost the footing on their sex drives then it doesn’t take long a few months maybe six months on working to build them back up into giving them new skills teaching them how to communicate because that’s usually where things started to break down his communication and helping him to make her feel sexy and attractive to bring her in and then teaching her as well how to maybe change things up differently in the bedroom so that he’s like more into it as well if you are coaxing your wife do you have sex when she doesn’t want to and you’re like no let’s go please whatever is that a form of abuse is that if she were to finally give in and say yes um to please you when she doesn’t want to is that what kind of is that positive or or negative sexual interaction at that point I’m not sure that I would categorize that as abuse abuse but it falls under like a high level of pressure and we never want to pressure somebody into having to say yes because then when they do say yes and I don’t want it that’s where it can become that gray area of did did he just like sexually abuse me or like I feel violated in some way right him wanting to have sex with somebody because she hasn’t sex with him for six months it’s understandable why he’s reached the place of frustration right because if I’m a sexual being then me not getting that need met is going to make me feel like my wife doesn’t want me and I don’t have that satisfaction of this marriage right so I try to look at both sides of it but there should never be a point of somebody putting so much pressure or begging the relationship to have sex that it’s gonna make no matter what the intentions are if his intentions are I just miss being close with you she’s still gonna walk away from that encounter feeling violated and that’s where it turns into something that’s really wrong is that the same thing with like unwanted playful groping I it’s really interesting because I have a lot of female clients who they’re like I feel really off when my husband just walks up to me and puts his hands on me like he thinks he can just do that whenever he wants free fully so I feel in every relationship especially right now there needs to be like expectations set up front of okay what are we what’s acceptable what’s not acceptable so everybody’s aligned and on the same page of what do I want what do I have to ask for versus just doing and making sure that she’s feeling comfortable right but you know there needs to be some level of you know playfulness playfulness and like being able to like take physical connection with your partner yeah being able to touch my partner in a way because out of everybody in the entire world you and your partner have one the one thing in common that you have with that person that you don’t have with anybody else is that you two share the same bed so if I don’t have some level of freedom to like enjoy you and you enjoying me where it’s always this like clinical sign this consent form before I can like kiss my wife it’s gonna feel like I’m almost like a robotic relationship too so you know we need to take a little bit of a step back and take a breather to say just because he’s putting his hands on me doesn’t mean he’s doing it with the intentions of violating me right so we judge everybody else by their behaviors and we judge ourselves by our intentions we always no matter what whether we’re judging you or me judging me we have to apply both we have to look at behaviors and intentions his intentions are probably never I really want to hurt my wife today and this is how I’m going to do it and use the sexual platform to do that that’s never likely what’s going through his head it’s more of I really think my wife is hot and I want to have my hands all over her so there has to be some level of flexibility with this too there’s always one person that wants more sex than the other person I I feel that way in every relationship right yeah and most commonly I’m not saying women are not this way but most commonly it it’s with men right men you could I could go to my husband any time he’ll drop what he’s doing and he will have sex with me and I think that like men might masturbate more women might not right even say for example if a couple watches porn women will always look at another woman they will watch the other woman getting off and that will arouse them yeah so it’s it’s it’s a different dynamic on how to come to a place of pleasure yeah for sure it is I think though that women masturbating tends to be something that is more hidden so yeah like when I have any client and especially when I’m working with couples I always ask the sex questions and yes my male clients get uncomfortable and the women are like whatever but it’s surprisingly how many women actually masturbate almost as much as men do but yes it’s very typical for men to masturbate almost daily and they use porn to do it so I have a lot of women that are like shocked by this but their physical beings remember so we are more emotional so you know instead of like judgment on it it’s about understanding and researching to know what is what falls in the normal range right but I think there’s a stigma attached to like men are allowed to do whatever men are men masturbate men are this and women have to be like the dainty like classic women don’t do that right but but they do and it’s not at such low rates if you look at their research it’s not at like these low rates that only like one in every 400 000 women masturbate no it’s pretty it’s pretty high compared to you know what men are doing um what would you say to couples who are going through a rough spell in their like a dry spell a dry spell and they have a healthy relationship obviously we’re not talking about unhealthy relationships here because at the end of the day if you’re screaming at me I’m not going to want to have sex with you and that’s pretty normal right um but say you know you have couples that just kind of fell out of it right um yeah what would you say to them that’s usually where I’m working what I’m working with is it’s not that I don’t want to be with you it’s the day-to-day the day-to-day stuff all the kids and all that has kind of made us fall off track with that because we’re both tired it’s not because we don’t want to though so I always get them to schedule and we start with dating again how were you when you were dating your husband like all over each other right like try to go back to that mentality and go back to dating so I get them to schedule in even if we start with once a month I try to do two a month you you plan one he has to plan one so twice a month you’re going on a date and part of the date I talk about scheduling in or talking about or planning for what are we doing tonight with the sex side of this so that you’re starting to have like the sex conversation which can be very arousing for people and then you know that that’s where the date is leading to so it’s part of it but we’re going back to our roots of when we first met and you know I talk in the sessions obviously I talk about how to connect them as a couple because often we’re connected as a family unit at the end of the day when are you making time for your marital unit when which is your core unit of the family right you don’t keep that strong everything else starts to fade out and doesn’t do as well so I get them to just connect more as a couple and spend more time together and I don’t know if this is stretching but I find a lot of times you know when um people have a lot of my clients are in their 40s right and they’re getting divorced in their 40s and and I find that a lot of times when they find somebody it’s after a dry spell with their spouse right uh whether they’re looking to cheat or they’re not looking to cheat but they’re looking for that dating that passion that that connection that they somehow lost with their partner so I do feel like dating is really important and taking the time to really connect and I do feel like it can really revive a relationship of any kind right sometimes when you’re when you’re just going through your mundane things and you’re just trying to get through your day it can it can become so automated and it’s nice when you can kind of put put that aside and really focus on you as a couple yeah being together right yeah it’s all about connection yeah like I’m just a girl you’re just a guy we’re together we’re having dinner and just going back to basics not talking about the kids yes not talking about the families not talking about anything but just like you look amazing today I’m going out with my sexy wife I’m going out with my sexy husband yeah we’re just gonna go out for dinner what restaurant do we want to go to you know I think like validating the other person as well helps to make them feel like attached to you so if I’m not able to have a date every single night I’m still connecting and checking in with my partner during the day and giving him that like here’s a compliment of like hey your butt looks good in those jeans right or like yeah whatever throughout the day so that he is thinking about me during the day in like a sexual way so that when he comes home it’s still like okay now I can finally have her right it’s about that build up too so learning how to be really playful in it during the day when I’m not with you so that when we do come back together we want it versus like we have to do this or it’s an obligation right right and just really going again going back to what were you like when you first met try to recreate some of those days or those dates or those moments and really remember to have that gratitude for the person that I picked you as my partner so going back to thinking about them seeing them in that light too yeah I think that’s beautiful it’s like when you choose a partner you’re making that choice to be with someone to be intimate with someone to give your body to that someone to be able to share your body and have children and make humans with that someone that’s really powerful just pick the right person well thank you so much for coming on the show and thank you guys for watching this is a really great episode I hope you like subscribe and hit that notification bell for more episodes to come see you soon bye you